Kenya Talks

Kichwa, you're really scrapping the bottom of the barrel. Eti nowhere can ICC indictee be allowed to ran. Why has Ramush of Kosovo been allowed to participate in 3 elections so far whilst facing trial and now re-trial at ICTY -crimes at par with ICC crimes. This straw has long snapped. Look for another one.

Kosovo is a country of higher profile than kenya and yet we don't see the US trying to intimidate Ramush and Kosovo with sanctions just to block him from exercising his right as free innocent man albeit accused??.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramush_Haradinaj


Ramush unlike kenya duo on free bond had been arrested and detained; he appealed; and In 2007, ICTY, granted Ramush Haradinaj, a former Kosovo Liberation Army commander, permission to stand in the country’s elections whilst still on trial.

He has since stood in two elections including 2010...whilst facing re-trial after being acquitted.

There is no where you can tell us to treat a suspect facing trial (however serious) as if they were already guilty. That is just against the BASICS...that one is PRESUMED INNOCENT TILL PROVEN GUILTY.

Pundit, if you want to go intellectual, at least try to be honest in your comparison and differentiation: This kind of sloppiness and half-baked comparisons is what makes people like Ruto and Uhuru not well served by their advisors and supporters who want to tell them more of what they want to hear than the reality. Tell me how you campare the two cases and find them similar? Meanwhile here are some stack differences from the source you provided:

"Haradinaj served only 100 days as Prime Minister before being indicted for war crimes by the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia (ICTY), at The Hague. The indictment alleges that Haradinaj, as a commander within the KLA, committed crimes against humanity and violations of the laws or customs of war between March and September 1998, the alleged purpose of which was to exert control over territory, targeting both Serb, Albanian and Romani civilians.[8] He was acquitted on 3 April 2008, because of lack of convincing evidence."

"When the ICTY indictment was issued in March 2005, Haradinaj chose to step down immediately from his position as Prime Minister. The following day he travelled voluntarily to The Hague where he remained for two months until he was granted provisional release pending trial. Haradinaj received much praise for his actions and words at that time, which were perceived by many, including the International Crisis Group (ICG),[10] US Senator Joe Biden [9] and the late British Foreign Secretary Robin Cook [11] as having prevented violence and civil unrest."

Uhuru and Ruto are already indicted and their trial dates have been set unlike this guy who was indicted after he became prime minister. So why should Uhuru and Ruto ran for president just to stept down if they win to go to Hague and face trial. Chapter six is not even needed to stop these yahoos from running, the court can just use the fact that they will be unavailable to serve. Uhururuto need to follow this guys example and voluntarily spare the people of Kenya the drama of taking this matter to court by stopping their charade statehouse race.

Take you advice and go back and read more about Ramush. Okay let me try a moron version for your type.

Jan 2005: Ramush party win election and Ramush elected PM.

March 2005; 100 days later Ramush is indicted (warrant of arrest issued).

April 2005: Ramush resign and goes to Hague.

April 2005-2006; Ramush is detained and held in prison in Hague.

2007; Ramush contest detention and it goes to appeal chamber. ICTY appeal chamber release Ramush and allows him to engage in activities including politics as long as UN Mission didn't have a problem.

2007; Ramush goes back to Kosovo and contest election while going to trial at ICTY. He comes 3rd.

2008/09: Ramush is found innocent.

2010: Prosecutor re-open Ramush case afresh after allegation comes out that Ramush intimidated witness. The RE TRIAL is on as we speak.

2010: Ramush stand again for election; he comes 3rd.

As of now Ramush is going to trial and still play his role in politics; If election are held today; Ramush would stand.

Now Ruto and Uhuru case is easy; They are on free bond with two conditions.

Ramush has proven you can lead normal life as you face ICC crimes. The sudan rebels are still heading their rebel movement whilst attending trial. They jet into Chad..go to Holland..sit thro' the proceedings whenever they are on..fly back to their base..hivyo hivyo


The game changer for any suspect is whether they are detained or NOT. If you're free on free bond; you continue with your life as any other person as long as you attend trial.

Uhuru and Ruto were not detained..and therefore they will continue as free folks until they are jailed or released..a free folk is free to do all that you and i can do...including contesting for PORK..get that JOB..and leading normal life.

Next..before i go to Nairobi...tired of Mavoko already.

Kichwa Mbaya wrote:Pundit, if you want to go intellectual, at least try to be honest in your comparison and differentiation: This kind of sloppiness and half-baked comparisons is what makes people like Ruto and Uhuru not well served by their advisors and supporters who want to tell them more of what they want to hear than the reality. Tell me how you campare the two cases and find them similar? Meanwhile here are some stack differences from the source you provided:

"Haradinaj served only 100 days as Prime Minister before being indicted for war crimes by the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia (ICTY), at The Hague. The indictment alleges that Haradinaj, as a commander within the KLA, committed crimes against humanity and violations of the laws or customs of war between March and September 1998, the alleged purpose of which was to exert control over territory, targeting both Serb, Albanian and Romani civilians.[8] He was acquitted on 3 April 2008, because of lack of convincing evidence."

"When the ICTY indictment was issued in March 2005, Haradinaj chose to step down immediately from his position as Prime Minister. The following day he travelled voluntarily to The Hague where he remained for two months until he was granted provisional release pending trial. Haradinaj received much praise for his actions and words at that time, which were perceived by many, including the International Crisis Group (ICG),[10] US Senator Joe Biden [9] and the late British Foreign Secretary Robin Cook [11] as having prevented violence and civil unrest."

Uhuru and Ruto are already indicted and their trial dates have been set unlike this guy who was indicted after he became prime minister. So why should Uhuru and Ruto ran for president just to stept down if they win to go to Hague and face trial. Chapter six is not even needed to stop these yahoos from running, the court can just use the fact that they will be unavailable to serve. Uhururuto need to follow this guys example and voluntarily spare the people of Kenya the drama of taking this matter to court by stopping their charade statehouse race.

If you do not see the difference then you are a bigger moron than I thought.

Difference NO 1. Ramush ran and won the elections before he was indicted by the ICC and as soon as he was indicted he resigned. Uhuru and Ruto have already been indicted, so why in the hell should they ran just to resign if they win.

Difference NO2, Does Kosovo have anything similar to Chapter six in their constitution?

ICC has always said that they do not have any prohibition against political activity so long as someone keeps the court trials.

Uhuru and Ruto have conditions by ICC. They have to attend all the trials in person, and that they cannot engage in any activities that would incite violence.

I do not know what the Kosovo prime minister does, but the constitutional requirements for the president of Kenya requires them to be free to discharge the duties of the president of the republic. This requires his/her ability to be physically present in the country at all times. God forbids a war breaks or alshaabab unleashes a terrorist attack and the president of Kenya is in the middle of a withering cross examination. The ICC has already warned the Kenyan courts and the public that there are no immunities or waivers and therefore making it very clear that if we let these people ran and win, then we as a country has to leave with our choice.

Maybe Kosovo do not have an equivalent of Chapter six but the electoreate got the message and he came 3rd all the time. I thank god that we have chapter six and our electorate do not have to go through that kind of charade. We could use those resources to actually vote for people who can actually win and serve.

The best advise and the most patriotic advise to Ruto and Uhuru, is, let this one go, defend your case, get an acquital and ran for the office in the next elections. Put this country first. This sense of entitlement is disgustingly primitive and nautiating, to say the least.