Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

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Murata
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by Murata » Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:44 pm

I may choose to revisit this at a later time. But you should not hang all your hopes on falsehoods. The case was litigated and arguments were presented at the time. You should fault the IEBC lawyers for not pointing out that the petitioners were using fake documents at the time. But the documents were fake. We might be in agreement on that
obienga wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:22 pm
Nonsense, your hero Maraga and his 3 fellow judges wrote a 178 page judgment that they laboured through and struggled to read. You have proven that you cannot hide behind the judgment for you cannot cite out of 405 paragraphs any single point to prove any of your wild lies.

As I said, put up or shutup, you clearly cannot do the former.Its now all but clear that you're desperate to take off running mkia katikati ya miguu and you can only hope that no one will notice your ineptitude in coming to a battle of facts with nothing but empty Jakuonist inspired rants.
Murata wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:09 pm
More false logic. There's nothing to agree or disagree with in your paragraph. No substance in falsehoods. The documents were fake, end of story
obienga wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:51 pm
Substance my friend, I do not engage in half baked arguments fished out of thin air without substantiation. It shows you're incapable of credible analysis and thought but I can make it simple for you. What do you have to dispute in this paragraph? Can you point out the exact Maraga judgment where it is stated that they are false and that the exercise did not take place as outlined? I didn't know words could be false, so what are true words?

Did you have any facts to counter or are you now studying the numbers of words in my points? Its very simple bandika paragraph numbers hapa from the so called majority that support your latest BS claim about the forms in the courts custody! Put up or shut up.

obienga
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by obienga » Thu Sep 21, 2017 2:01 pm

When you revisit it, we can debate the facts. I do not know which falsehoods you are referring to unless what you mean to say that the SC Judge has falsehoods in her judgment which is a very serious matter.

Your point brings me back to where I started, when we go to court, we expect a level playing field with no shenanigans. If a party is swearing an oath, we expect them to uphold that oath and not to file affidavits that are false particularly in a matter of great national interest. The 14 days are grossly inadequate and so are 10 minutes to make presentations on a complex subject such as scrutiny. All parties including the bench have learned their respective lessons and the likelihood of a rematch in court is high, hopefully they have all have learned their lessons and will be better prepared for battle.
Murata wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:44 pm
I may choose to revisit this at a later time. But you should not hang all your hopes on falsehoods. The case was litigated and arguments were presented at the time. You should fault the IEBC lawyers for not pointing out that the petitioners were using fake documents at the time. But the documents were fake. We might be in agreement on that
obienga wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:22 pm
Nonsense, your hero Maraga and his 3 fellow judges wrote a 178 page judgment that they laboured through and struggled to read. You have proven that you cannot hide behind the judgment for you cannot cite out of 405 paragraphs any single point to prove any of your wild lies.

As I said, put up or shutup, you clearly cannot do the former.Its now all but clear that you're desperate to take off running mkia katikati ya miguu and you can only hope that no one will notice your ineptitude in coming to a battle of facts with nothing but empty Jakuonist inspired rants.
Murata wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:09 pm
More false logic. There's nothing to agree or disagree with in your paragraph. No substance in falsehoods. The documents were fake, end of story

NativeSon1
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by NativeSon1 » Thu Sep 21, 2017 3:17 pm

Forwardoh wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:35 am
NativeSon1 wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:21 am
Murata wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2017 4:05 pm
While I appreciate the laid out thoughts and arguments in Justice Njoki Ndungu d3centing, I thought she was not professional in working in collaboration with her peers and gave a sense of personal gripe in her delivery. I can see what the former Chief Justice was infering to. She seemed to disregard the fact that there was a petition that was specific in nature and it's merits or demerits and instead focused more on trying to disparage her peers findings imo
Nonsense!

Murata, this is cow dung and you know it!

wow!

Hapa sio pahali for making friends. This is serious business and when the going gets tough as the saying goes, let the tough get going.
Nonsense kitu gani?
So you have more jurisprudence under your belt than this woman to call others opinions cow dung? :shock:
Martha Karua@MarthaKarua
A dissenting judgment ought not be a trial of fellow judges but a treatise on why one holds a different view- differing with respect

Justice Ndung'u, a very learned woman, schooled the four thugs in law.

You should have seen their faces when she was inserting it in them.

Had it not been for her, we'd never have known the truth.

The majority never considered the evidence adduced but instead relied on fake Naswa propaganda which Ndung'u tore to pieces.

Thank you lady Justice!
Last edited by NativeSon1 on Thu Sep 21, 2017 3:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.
.

NativeSon1
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by NativeSon1 » Thu Sep 21, 2017 3:32 pm

Murata wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:44 pm
I may choose to revisit this at a later time. But you should not hang all your hopes on falsehoods. The case was litigated and arguments were presented at the time. You should fault the IEBC lawyers for not pointing out that the petitioners were using fake documents at the time. But the documents were fake. We might be in agreement on that
obienga wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:22 pm
Nonsense, your hero Maraga and his 3 fellow judges wrote a 178 page judgment that they laboured through and struggled to read. You have proven that you cannot hide behind the judgment for you cannot cite out of 405 paragraphs any single point to prove any of your wild lies.

As I said, put up or shutup, you clearly cannot do the former.Its now all but clear that you're desperate to take off running mkia katikati ya miguu and you can only hope that no one will notice your ineptitude in coming to a battle of facts with nothing but empty Jakuonist inspired rants.
Murata wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:09 pm
More false logic. There's nothing to agree or disagree with in your paragraph. No substance in falsehoods. The documents were fake, end of story
Murata,

There was collaboration [apparently] between kunaswa and the judiciary.

Kunaswa had the registrar in their pocket and somehow filed or planted fake/false evidence [forms] which the court then used to annul the election.


Nasa are thieves. They are trying to steal Uhurus election and in doing so, they are getting help from the courts!

Someone needs to pay for this high crime!
.

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Tupatane
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by Tupatane » Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:27 pm

IMG_2431.JPG
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SaltyLight
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by SaltyLight » Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:37 pm

Murata wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:44 pm
I may choose to revisit this at a later time. But you should not hang all your hopes on falsehoods. The case was litigated and arguments were presented at the time. You should fault the IEBC lawyers for not pointing out that the petitioners were using fake documents at the time. But the documents were fake. We might be in agreement on that
obienga wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:22 pm
Nonsense, your hero Maraga and his 3 fellow judges wrote a 178 page judgment that they laboured through and struggled to read. You have proven that you cannot hide behind the judgment for you cannot cite out of 405 paragraphs any single point to prove any of your wild lies.

As I said, put up or shutup, you clearly cannot do the former.Its now all but clear that you're desperate to take off running mkia katikati ya miguu and you can only hope that no one will notice your ineptitude in coming to a battle of facts with nothing but empty Jakuonist inspired rants.
Murata wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:09 pm
More false logic. There's nothing to agree or disagree with in your paragraph. No substance in falsehoods. The documents were fake, end of story
Why do you keep repeating that line of argument? Muite and Ngatia were given only ten minutes and they both raised the issue of the signatures. They pointed out that the forms they had had the signatures and the serial numbers. So what did you want hem to do?

In any case, the judge had already received evidence before him and it was their job to see whether the report flowed with what was before them.

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Pamba
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by Pamba » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:46 am

So now the official Japati line is that the Judges relied on fake forms to annul the election and that the forms brought by Chiloba and Co had not been certified therefore they were not valid for scrutiny

Facts that refuse to go away:
1) IEBC provided the forms themselves
Image
2) During the scrutiny each party i.e. Jubilee, Nasa, and IEBC had their representatives present (Good lawyers themselves) as the scrutiny was being carried out and even delivered their own reports to their various lead lawyers. Case in point Orengos report was one of them, he attempted to read it out but Muite and Ngatia objected and it was disallowed by SC judges. What did the Japati and IEBC reports say?
3) Where did the Njoki certified copies of true originals (FAKES) come from? You mean IEBC sent two sets of Forms to the Supreme court?


SaltyLight wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:37 pm
Murata wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:44 pm
I may choose to revisit this at a later time. But you should not hang all your hopes on falsehoods. The case was litigated and arguments were presented at the time. You should fault the IEBC lawyers for not pointing out that the petitioners were using fake documents at the time. But the documents were fake. We might be in agreement on that
obienga wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:22 pm
Nonsense, your hero Maraga and his 3 fellow judges wrote a 178 page judgment that they laboured through and struggled to read. You have proven that you cannot hide behind the judgment for you cannot cite out of 405 paragraphs any single point to prove any of your wild lies.

As I said, put up or shutup, you clearly cannot do the former.Its now all but clear that you're desperate to take off running mkia katikati ya miguu and you can only hope that no one will notice your ineptitude in coming to a battle of facts with nothing but empty Jakuonist inspired rants.
Why do you keep repeating that line of argument? Muite and Ngatia were given only ten minutes and they both raised the issue of the signatures. They pointed out that the forms they had had the signatures and the serial numbers. So what did you want hem to do?

In any case, the judge had already received evidence before him and it was their job to see whether the report flowed with what was before them.
“Bomet is not Kabete where ‘Baba Yao’ (Waititu) won the seat on a JAP ticket.” (Isaac Ruto, 2015) :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

SaltyLight
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by SaltyLight » Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:06 am

Those are questions you should be asking. it could also be that the registrar gave fake results or NASA slipped fake results in collusion with akombe

Garlic
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by Garlic » Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:08 am

For your information those forms have been online much earlier. So stop construction of conspiracy theories to heap blame on Njoki. Its not her fault the Wakora4 didn't bother to check. But its Okay, bribe has a way of clouding brains.

Pamba wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:46 am
So now the official Japati line is that the Judges relied on fake forms to annul the election and that the forms brought by Chiloba and Co had not been certified therefore they were not valid for scrutiny

Facts that refuse to go away:
1) IEBC provided the forms themselves
Image
2) During the scrutiny each party i.e. Jubilee, Nasa, and IEBC had their representatives present (Good lawyers themselves) as the scrutiny was being carried out and even delivered their own reports to their various lead lawyers. Case in point Orengos report was one of them, he attempted to read it out but Muite and Ngatia objected and it was disallowed by SC judges. What did the Japati and IEBC reports say?
3) Where did the Njoki certified copies of true originals (FAKES) come from? You mean IEBC sent two sets of Forms to the Supreme court?


SaltyLight wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:37 pm
Murata wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:44 pm
I may choose to revisit this at a later time. But you should not hang all your hopes on falsehoods. The case was litigated and arguments were presented at the time. You should fault the IEBC lawyers for not pointing out that the petitioners were using fake documents at the time. But the documents were fake. We might be in agreement on that
Why do you keep repeating that line of argument? Muite and Ngatia were given only ten minutes and they both raised the issue of the signatures. They pointed out that the forms they had had the signatures and the serial numbers. So what did you want hem to do?

In any case, the judge had already received evidence before him and it was their job to see whether the report flowed with what was before them.

obienga
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by obienga » Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:41 am

Jakuonists keep trying to retell the tale only that their version is different each time they try to do so. The certified forms were deposited with the court within 48 hours of the petition having been filed.
Under the law, IEBC is required within 48 hours upon filing of a presidential petition, file certified copies of the documents used to declare a presidential result.

The statutory documents that will be filed include the Forms 34B that are used by constituency returning officers to aggregate presidential results from polling stations.

There are 40,883 Forms 34A, 290 Forms 34B and one Form 34C. Forms 34A are used by presiding officers to tabulate presidential results at the polling stations. https://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2017/08 ... n_c1620515
Garlic wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:08 am
For your information those forms have been online much earlier. So stop construction of conspiracy theories to heap blame on Njoki. Its not her fault the Wakora4 didn't bother to check. But its Okay, bribe has a way of clouding brains.

obienga
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by obienga » Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:53 am

To find sense in certain things, years of nonstop brainwashing is a must.

Picture this...

You are told, through an emotional presser, that the IEBC Server has been hacked and compromised by Jubilee...you are told the numbers in the server are fake and can't be trusted. You believe it.

Less than 24hrs later, another presser is called. This time you are told (by the same people) that a screenshot of the results in the IEBC Server shows your candidate has won. You forget they had told you whatever was in the server couldn't be trusted because it had been manipulated by hackers in favor of Uhuruto, and believe the new contradiction without questions.

At the court, you see people who had accessed the server to expose hacking and later accessed it to take screenshots of your victory, begging for access to the IEBC Servers. Instead of feeling duped, you choose to believe they didn't have access to the server but also hold on to their previous claims (claims that mean they had access to the server).

IEBC allegedly refuses to open the servers within time and another presser is called. This time, you are told IEBC is refusing to open the server because they know that it'll show your candidate won. And you believe it. You believe a server manipulated to favor Uhuruto will show your candidate won.

In other words, you find sense in claims that proof of your victory is within a compromised server (one whose numbers can't be trusted) and not in the ballot box.

Why don't we just #OpenTheBallotBoxes and see how you won? Oh, you can't trust sealed ballot boxes..but trust a hacked server to prove your victory?

Lawd! Let me fix tea...making sense of some thought processes needs strong antioxidants. https://www.facebook.com/samson.ogola/p ... 3020074852

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NattyDread
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by NattyDread » Fri Sep 22, 2017 5:03 am

obienga wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:41 am
Jakuonists keep trying to retell the tale only that their version is different each time they try to do so. The certified forms were deposited with the court within 48 hours of the petition having been filed.
Bre'r obienga,

There is a point at which debating a JaKuonist becomes self-immolation. You have told them more than 40 times that the IEBC delivered all the forms but the rogue SC judge only had eyes for what NASA had dramatically delivered in a Canter lorry at midnight (which they also admitted they did not read before ruling!).

The registrar's summary seems to have been the only document they relied on. Listening to Mwilu's stuttering reading, many details of the ruling were literally taken from NASA's petition and affidavits.

Justice Njoki Ndung'u will go down in history as the one who scuttled NASA's judicial coup, because she actually read and analyzed the respondents' documents.
:evil: JaKuon Slayer Extraordinaire :twisted:

obienga
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by obienga » Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:02 am

NattyDread wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 5:03 am
obienga wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:41 am
Jakuonists keep trying to retell the tale only that their version is different each time they try to do so. The certified forms were deposited with the court within 48 hours of the petition having been filed.
Bre'r obienga,

There is a point at which debating a JaKuonist becomes self-immolation. You have told them more than 40 times that the IEBC delivered all the forms but the rogue SC judge only had eyes for what NASA had dramatically delivered in a Canter lorry at midnight (which they also admitted they did not read before ruling!).

The registrar's summary seems to have been the only document they relied on. Listening to Mwilu's stuttering reading, many details of the ruling were literally taken from NASA's petition and affidavits.

Justice Njoki Ndung'u will go down in history as the one who scuttled NASA's judicial coup, because she actually read and analyzed the respondents' documents.
NattyDread,

Jakuonists are suffering from years of brain washing that common sense and logic no longer applies to their thought process. I am eagerly awaiting for any Jakuonist to make a filing to the JSC on the basis of her opinion and findings. They know it is a slippery slope for them and they will fall never to get up.

You are right. The fact that the ruling was pronounced does not mean this is the end of it as far as history goes. I believe the matter will unravel itself and be laid to bare for future generations when all is said and done.

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Pamba
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by Pamba » Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:04 am

The problem is you think you are the only one with internet and the only one who checked the forms online

Image

If there was a bribe, jubilee with all its government machinery would have unearthed it and used it to properly discredit the good Justice. No bribe was given and thats why the lame duck president keeps issuing threats.

Jibu maswali.....why are you so slippery?
Garlic wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:08 am
For your information those forms have been online much earlier. So stop construction of conspiracy theories to heap blame on Njoki. Its not her fault the Wakora4 didn't bother to check. But its Okay, bribe has a way of clouding brains.

Pamba wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:46 am
So now the official Japati line is that the Judges relied on fake forms to annul the election and that the forms brought by Chiloba and Co had not been certified therefore they were not valid for scrutiny

Facts that refuse to go away:
1) IEBC provided the forms themselves
Image
2) During the scrutiny each party i.e. Jubilee, Nasa, and IEBC had their representatives present (Good lawyers themselves) as the scrutiny was being carried out and even delivered their own reports to their various lead lawyers. Case in point Orengos report was one of them, he attempted to read it out but Muite and Ngatia objected and it was disallowed by SC judges. What did the Japati and IEBC reports say?
3) Where did the Njoki certified copies of true originals (FAKES) come from? You mean IEBC sent two sets of Forms to the Supreme court?


SaltyLight wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:37 pm


Why do you keep repeating that line of argument? Muite and Ngatia were given only ten minutes and they both raised the issue of the signatures. They pointed out that the forms they had had the signatures and the serial numbers. So what did you want hem to do?

In any case, the judge had already received evidence before him and it was their job to see whether the report flowed with what was before them.
“Bomet is not Kabete where ‘Baba Yao’ (Waititu) won the seat on a JAP ticket.” (Isaac Ruto, 2015) :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

obienga
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Re: Dissenting Opinion Detailed Forms Analysis - Njoki SCJ

Unread post by obienga » Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:47 am

Image
Image
Pamba wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:04 am
The problem is you think you are the only one with internet and the only one who checked the forms online

Image

If there was a bribe, jubilee with all its government machinery would have unearthed it and used it to properly discredit the good Justice. No bribe was given and thats why the lame duck president keeps issuing threats.

Jibu maswali.....why are you so slippery?
Garlic wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:08 am
For your information those forms have been online much earlier. So stop construction of conspiracy theories to heap blame on Njoki. Its not her fault the Wakora4 didn't bother to check. But its Okay, bribe has a way of clouding brains.

Pamba wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:46 am
So now the official Japati line is that the Judges relied on fake forms to annul the election and that the forms brought by Chiloba and Co had not been certified therefore they were not valid for scrutiny

Facts that refuse to go away:
1) IEBC provided the forms themselves
Image
2) During the scrutiny each party i.e. Jubilee, Nasa, and IEBC had their representatives present (Good lawyers themselves) as the scrutiny was being carried out and even delivered their own reports to their various lead lawyers. Case in point Orengos report was one of them, he attempted to read it out but Muite and Ngatia objected and it was disallowed by SC judges. What did the Japati and IEBC reports say?
3) Where did the Njoki certified copies of true originals (FAKES) come from? You mean IEBC sent two sets of Forms to the Supreme court?




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